"Combat RP" and "Battle Mods"
Fri Oct 15, 2021 9:31 pm
- Modding:
- Tempris:
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t57811-alistair-s-starting-spells#508208
This person left, and if you look at the edit time, they added spell circles. ? Why are spell circles so important, as long as spell rules say spell circles exist/there's motions spells are still obvious?
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t57696-beelzanebub-summons#508370
It has the range at 5 meters. Again, what's with the spell circle obsession?
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58699-monthly-devourer-spells-3#508714
This doesn't follow the standard of him copying Steel's Thunder.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58088-monthly-devourer-spells-2#501824
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58560-jin-s-a-and-s-rank-spells#513235
Dunno why this takes so long, I don't think it should matter so much whether enhancement's stated or not.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58600-lucretia-wolfenstein-s-starter-spells#508246
The defense spell cannot reduce physical attacks by a minor amount.
Seika:
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t59224-crystal-demon-slayer-magic-vol5#514248
Seika/Tempris trying to push that you can't release a spell from your body, like a wave.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58998-frost-dragon-slayer-spell-vol-3#511853
I'm really not seeing why "make spell circles clear, when the rules say so already" is so important.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58993-living-light-starter-spells#512044
Kinda wrong, as it's confusing with Berserker modifier, should just be "D-rank boost" imo.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t59139-feds-s-rank#513088
Spells don't really do lore. Same with the heavy pressure. Smokescreen spells were denied, as they're meant to be for blind elements.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58968-control-m-iii#513292
The rules already say summons can only come from the ground. Smokescreens again have been denied before, they're not supposed to replace allowed-element blinds of A-S.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58994-frost-dragon-slayer-spell-vol-2#513301
Frost can't use blind-type spells.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t59048-lucretia-mausoleum-magic-c-rank#512493
Overture II cannot reduce physical attacks by a minor amount.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58936-the-fundamentals-of-disease-living-plague-mastery-spells#510955
These spells don't stack for the debuff and kinda useless due to constitution debuff just being what you heal to.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58891-takeover-lucifer-spells-2#510605
Uuuh first spell what? Autohits people somehow to not sense you. Second spell uuuh what? It's saying he's blind immune. Seika's friend of years.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58816-heavenly-body-magic-pg-2#511766
Similar to Jove with Seika. The sight spell gives Byakugan, which perty sure is in Mysterious Merchant/God of War.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58960-infinifty-void-starters#510964
You only get 4 starter spells.
https://www.fairytailrp.com/t58718-a-ranked-earth-spells-1#510666
Bubbling Muck moves someone along with binding, 2 spells in one.
Fighting generally has 2 things that can be improved. First, make a battle mod guide for all staff to understand in staff forum. Unbiased process through dismissals, force the fighters to talk, force the fighters to stick to their original point, and quicker process instead of building drama. No escalation, no forced conclusion. Past precedents.
Secondly, members should be clear about the process. Otherwise, they flake over days and weeks waiting for it to play out.
Basic mod guide:
- Don't rule on a friendly topic in a way where it ends it.
- Simple DnD NPCing, otherwise battle mod is over-burdened.
- Tell anybody that privately contacts to talk to their opponent instead.
Shared Guide
- Someone requesting a battle mod freezes the topic for 48 hr normally. They must talk to their opponent, unless a shop item or rule unique to FTRP was directly broken.
- The battle mod requester must post IC and include what they want on the forum before 48 hours.
- The topic is locked as soon as possible when arguments are posted. Note OOC posts will be recycled afterward due to profile point gain.
- The battle mod and the fighters need to understand only what was originally called for is getting ruled on. No new ideas.
- After everyone's clear on above, ask what each person wants but refer to the OOC posts still.
- A NPC account should be used to avoid blame weeks later.
- Note the ruling will be simple. If the winner isn't clear, the post round can be voided.
- The topic will be voided if contacted quickly over something minor. This will not be advantageous to either side. Fight rewards will still be given. In the case of a tournament or event, another fight occurs with a shortened timer.
Bad "Combat RP" Gotchas (with examples):
Saying spell motions are needed if performing a spell that can only be done by those motions (unwritten battle modding)
Adding bad clarifications to vague rules or nerfing mid-fight (white knight forceful battle modding)
Vague manipulating as the battle modder to bunny and end a fight quick (glorifying battle modding)
Not forcing ties when they're supposed to happen (hateful battle modding)
Locking in one part of a post and ignoring the rest unless it defied the world completely (timeline checkers)
High m/s speed and AoE spawn blitzing as if it can't be reacted to (Hakai, various fights, similar is Jove/Erebus spawning next to people)
Having longer rulings for those you're preferential to and taking an "unfair win" such as 48 hr personal (Jove)
Not saying one side is wrong in any way (Jove when ruling on Noel)
Forcing what you want the rules to be rather than what they are due to not reading them (Jove Warrior/Yugo)
Evaluating more errors for the side you consider unfair due to donating or RPing more than you (Jove ruling BP fight)
Personally seeking vengeance IC and backing out after a ruling that makes you look bad (Jove against Tomoe/Masa/guy after Vali was 48hr'd "unfairly")
Using "interrupting" to pretend a person needs to rewrite their post when you did nothing to physically interrupt them (Noel v women)
Not letting anything hit you meaningfully (Noel v Caius and Yumi)
Ignoring defenses to try to one shot through multiple strikes (most speed blitzers)
Saying vague manipulating has a subjective limit (Noel)
Using temporary loss of partial sight to instantly win (Noel, various people)
Easily losing to a friend as a NPCer (Jove loss to Roman, Odin dragon to Steel)
Not letting anything affect a NPC until their friend beats them (Cell Jove)
Overcomplicating melee to project actual ability (Noel v Jove)
- Past Tournaments, "Combat RP" Tropes:
- Sporadically active people want quick ends. Their "combat RP" starts and ends at showboating without organizing or encouraging growth to people. Imposing and forcing "how" to fight on others is innately pressuring them as inferior, lacking special qualities that these inactive and elitist "combat RPers" simply don't possess. Because they're inconsistent, they're generally ignorant of site rules they didn't want.
Most of these examples below aren't as active now, winning or not, from unsatisfying and illogical rulings.- Admin Angst:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t53421-kazimir-seiryu-vs-konstantin-sokolov
-Activity-wise Kazimir is superior to Kon and on-paper stronger. Jove and Kon like each other or not, I feel like Jove wanted to assert his "authority" as a longer admin than Kon.
-The spell doesn't say you can't prep an attack, you can prep spell motions after teleports. Kon tried to connect a hit, it doesn't mean ending the fight because he's wrong is right.
-Jove says Kazimir grabs Kon from under his field of vision, ignoring basic humans have peripheral vision.
-There's a "Naruto gotcha" applied here to Kon where you "need to state hand seals" or the jutsu doesn't cast on some sites. It's not in FTRP rules, it's not applicable for spell motions and spells. Stating you're casting a spell is doing any motions that could be used for that spell, even if open to vague manipulating those unwritten motions.
-6 strength=D spell=has no durability comparisons, can shatter rocks. Kon doesn't need to grab a windpipe specifically if the opponent didn't block, a vital hit is a vital hit.
- These people "don't matter":
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t53432-joshua-graham-vs-requiem
-The outcome desired is "Yugo loses". He didn't dodge, but he did attack with Requiem's sliding. Both of them KO/Yugo interrupts. Jove makes an "assumption". Nah, you don't do assumptions or what you want as battle mod. Equipment spells being limited was a rule added months after this fight, you don't just rule something not in the rules.
-Jove said Yugo's character "was in shock" and stood still to bunny Yugo; he consistently makes this ruling to hand wave auto-hit fights to their end.
- He stayed STILL:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t53433-akihiko-sterling-vs-steel
-I agree Steel "one posts" Akihiko, Jove doesn't come to a sensical conclusion. Jove just makes up some silliness of the person standing still again; I Googled Akihiko's stance and it's just holding your sword to the side. Steel and Jove are friends off-site, Steel also idolized.
- My friend needs face:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t53429-vali-onfroy-vs-tomoe-tanaka
-Vali/Zeke says his Bullet Magic reaches quicker than a second. Empowered by site numbers combined with distance, he says Tomoe can't react at all at the 1st instance! No, denied.
-Why should I read the rest of Jove's ruling? That was his only job to say, that was all Zeke asked for calling the hit. Anything more was bunnying/acting on Zeke's behalf? Jove and Zeke are in an off-site chat as friends of years.
-Tomoe corrects Jove, Jove lashes out. Jove can't take that slight against his battle modness. Vali was skipped, why did Jove mention anything else?
- My MUZI needs my effort:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t53423-yumi-hateshiginai-vs-noel-raion
-This is one of Jove's longest rulings, not because of there being more content to cover.
-Noel beat Jove before, so he considers Noel "flawless", he doesn't rule against Noel at all.
-Someone already made Noel's error, Noel is a long-term member and staff. Noel is the only one getting a real second chance in the tourney, it's biased as Jove rules other people losing instantly to mistakes.
-"Nothing would be safe from this spells wrath as it had only one intention, to drown Noel in its crimson blaze to turn him into a scorching charred corpse that no longer sustained life."
"These two spells would make it imp; possible for anyone to fly up out of their path due to their sheer size and ass."
Compared to Noel saying:
"Since his flight spell was active, this spell made no contact with Noel, as he was off the ground for the entirety of the fight instead."
All that matters here battle modding is whether Noel actually dodged or blocked. There is no "magical timeline" order of the lines, Noel simply did not dodge or block.
"---The third spell took effect at the same time as these two S ranks were unleashed.--- Unlike the S ranks it was only a B rank spell but would provide additional coverage for the daemon in her attempt to wipe out her foe who was only twelve and a half metres from her."
Compare to what Noel SELECTIVELY quoted of it to gaslight.
"So here you describe me being twelve and a half meter away, but not in relation to what you were doing - just that Noel was twelve and a half meters away from her at one point"
"Unlike the S ranks it was only a B rank spell but would provide additional coverage for the daemon in her attempt to wipe out her foe who was only twelve and a half metres from her."
"The unchained daemon stood amongst her flames in all her glory as they washed over the arena consuming it in her angry wrath."
"Regardless if her foe would continue charging or not, Yumi would still cast her spells to still engulf the arena in fire."
"So here's Yumi standing still amidst the action,"
^He's implying somehow Yumi can't change what they do next post based off their opponent, as if Yumi will just sit still like Jove and Noel want people to.
I know for a fact Noel made statistical errors (which he admitted to, not edited in to this day) in my fight with Erebus, so I'm not going to take his word for it that his calculations are right. Yumi's staff can break, but Noel not dodging/blocking means Yumi could call hits as well on their next post. AoE can deal damage multiple times.
The user includes their equipment (meaning it's not broken) besides self-immunity (which is lulok Noel balancing). Unless Napalm was edited afterward, I'm too lazy to see if this was the spell Noel selected for his self-combustion hazing.
Jove's ruling tries to have the spells clash (which Noel's argument post doesn't include). It doesn't matter if Noel mentioned it OOC, his actual post has the spells hitting him. Jove's bunnying in Noel's favor. Any called hit ignored is also an interrupt.
- Kaiser is "unfair", only "cheating" can beat them:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t53422-caius-kazama-vs-kaiser-bo
"but the actual ruling for the tournament is one cannot prep their spells and attacks during their first post"
"or to find ways to rush and screw over their opponent due to weird entrance posts"
When did Jove make this ruling that somehow applies to the whole tournament and site? After people started posting? What does he construe as weird??? People should get into a somehow advantageous fighting stance like him? No, having a guy pointing a finger or their body toward a direction from 1st post to "cast faster unfairly" shouldn't be what determines rulings. There is no reaction speed on this site, this is trying to force a magical form of reaction speed.
"You have to basically just stand still now until you would have hit that point."
Or Jove just determines his rulings based off how he feels like bunnying people to stand still.
- Anything non-OP done by Alisa and Venus is "invalid":
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t53420-alisa-vollan-vs-venus-rose
"Due to a spell making it through approval that should not have, Alisa has been allowed to edit said spell."
This depends entirely on what that spell did, whether it was illogical or not. If it set a precedent without breaking balance at the time, then it shouldn't have been edited for this topic.
I don't know why Jove is mentioning multiple posts that might not be relevant. A battle mod can note mistakes in prior posts for teaching, but at hand they're only to rule on the post round, what they were requested for. Unless there's been inconsistency that breaks things entirely for ruling.
"I have to assume that the hope was that a B rank spell would somehow deflect a sword that is bringing forth 2S rank worth of damage. It is definitely not."
Jove was a Warrior, so this is his personal input. You can damage items. IRL-wise, you can parry with weaker force. Items mostly don't affect spells beside soaking damage. Spells can certainly move items by basic logic though.
"However, Alisa was charging forward full speed (40m/s). She would have been able to stop and slam her foot down and redirect herself backwards, but she'd be unable to just turn like that. Not a chance in hell."
??? Jove mentions reaction speed in seconds again later in his post. Jove's post is pretty long, making lots of assumptions and setting actions when there were disqualifying mistakes for the round. The correct thing would be to let the RPers write again, not bunnying them on what you want.
- Jove's going to do something himself! NVM:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t54327-learning-what-lurks-below-open
Evidently, Jove had something to prove to Tomoe after that tournament topic. Jove invades unprompted, arrogant writing people would say "he's just playing a character in method acting".
"He had trained relentlessly since gaining this new form, and he had tested his body against some small fry.
And he was about to do so again.
"Hello," he said to the three men who would only just become aware of his presence, still in their starting spots. None of them had yet casted magic, likely due to Jove's arrival being near when the blond individual had finished speaking. His introduction had come literally on the last syllable that he'd uttered, and right when he'd have become visible to them. There had simply been no time for them to act yet. This was going to be fun."
Jove just spawns next to these people and godmods expecting nothing to be done. He invades 2 A-ranks?+ and chickens out.
- lolno culture:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t48671-man-down-private
Culture-wise, I don't see a difference to these old posts to people's opinions now.
"I interrupted your attack from happening by not allowing you to be within one meter of me."
How did Noel physically interrupt this person?
"OOC: The spell seems to be homing, homing spells require that the user uses their arm in order to guide it. You didn't specify that your arms were still pointing at me, nor does the spell require you to so I'm pretty unfamiliar with what'd happen. In any case, it requires visionary contact."
I'm just guessing based off site rules at the time, but I don't think homing on any site is founded based off visual contact, if the spell at the time didn't need other things. If homing was changed, it was off Noel. Noel seems to just really dislike homing to this day.
- Homing and nothing worthy hits me:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t45053-operation-snake-skinner-event
Case in point, Noel hating Caius's homing here too.
"I didn't avoid the first one--in turn you'd fire your second spell according to your rp. More importantly, you based this attack based off of me moving, which is conflicting since I begun moving when you did, and never stopped(I stated in my previous post that my actions were reactionary to yours, which means you move=I move. Which implies that I never stop moving, even though I stated I'd do so--which essentially means that I voided myself in doing that)"
He based it off you moving, what are you trying to gaslight away here?
"It is certainly true that your spell is bigger, but with Larvitar having taken the brunt of the damage by facing it head on, and with my having my arm removed far away from the impact--the damage converted to me in this context is almost minimal. It'd actually be nothing considering Larvitar consumed all of the damage, simply physically blocked."
AOEs don't work like that currently at least.
"The other would be full speed can't be built up since this happening in in a second or two and it states it takes around 3-4 for full speed."
If that's a rule at the time and not a rule you later added. Even if it is, what did they need their full speed for exactly, or is this a strawman?
- CHECKMATE atheists:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t42521-the-ark-s-one-shot-event
"There's an issue I have with this statement. You can see me, but the rest cannot; how do you know the rest cannot see me?"
They're a Vampire of whatever iteration at that time, they know their sight capability others might not possess? Is Noel's whole idea of fighting just gaslighting like people are inferior?
- I beat you up everywhere. It's over.:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t41715-semi-finals-maarschalk-vs-arisa
"However he were to react at all, her hands were remain a defensive posture over her head, ready to act and deflect any attack that he would throw at her."
Until this line, I figured ya Noel just attacks a non-defended area. Notice how the battle modder doesn't mention this line at all.
It doesn't matter it's "over her head" at the start. The writing then goes to "deflect any attack". If I had to react to something vague like that, I'd say grappling perhaps, it's not something to ignore though. Their intent? Well, that's unknown, but they probably didn't want to be one-posted.
- Accept I walk up and one-shot, don't make change:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t41662-round-2-erebus-vs-maarschalk
"but you've really dug deep with how much you changed it. As ifty as it is"
No. Erebus and anybody is allowed to do this without being insinuated as inferior.
"Since I have from this post mentioned or rather vague manipulated the distance between us two be adequate enough for me to readjust to you moving forwards, I can claim my hit."
You'd be surprised, but distance generally doesn't matter fighting. How, exactly, does adding the distance alone enable him to connect a hit here?
- You didn't see it? Can't defend:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t41621-round-1-atlas-vs-maarschalk
Personally, I think this is the fight where we coached Noel on Skype things about combat RP in a FTRP tournament, but I can't remember exactly. The weird underlines and boldings, I don't recall seeing that in other fights. The general idea was to note that you can add in things later in a post for consistency, without establishing a timeline. The insertion of distance later on in his fight with Erebus in the tournament matches that, but I think that's a second step rather than a first. In general, I think 2017 is when Noel started learning "Combat RP".
It'd be very obvious reading and comparing the posts which ones Noel was experimenting on for that.
I'm not feeling it for this fight to go down line to line of OOC. The comment I'd make is that Noel's habit is that he "adjusts/notes" the height of limbs so people can't react or see, yet that doesn't consistently hold IRL fighting or anywhere. It's gaslighting.
- Jove's NPC so he's a god until his friend wins:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t43301-cell-games
Their first post they potentially invalidate multiple posts as a Story NPC, maximum OOC flex that they're allowed to do that. The explosion is at the start of the 1st post so lolwhat. Did people just associate it to Teiho's dragon "blast"? Cell's 1st post has an explosion.
"If Teiho would like to contest these hits, he must address the battle mod of this thread: Maarschalk."
With Jove's opinion of Maarschalk, I don't think he's contested anything Noel's said ever.
"Primarily due to the distance traveled and the time it was traveled in leaving myself with the availability of not only being able to see him due to moving the instant the beam was fired, but also stopping outside of the beam and at the very least 5 meters away from where I would be in the same time frame of travel that he gave for me."
I don't know what Teiho's trying to say. It's bizarre that Noel has the same battle mod "writing style" 3 years later though. The difference here is that he keeps running on with sentences weirdly too, I don't know what Teiho or Noel said in this topic lol. I'd try if I could, I'd have to actually read this silly topic entirely. It's bizarre Roman joined the topic after being involved in ruling.
You know, all sites have these "legendary" topics usually people can refer to. There's some leniency, if they're older ones. I'm looking at this, Roman joins, and then his next attack post he connects hits for free. The post contains an edgy gif of "I'll kill everyone you love" lol. Cell got one-posted by OOC pecking order.
- Hype my event up and lose already:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t42708-while-we-wait-private-houren-kazu#359940
Well, here's Noel's "you ran into a wall and lose" ruling though.
"This would mean that when he crashed into the wall, combined with the spell from Cell -- Mr. Houren would be left off-balance, incapable of establishing eye-of-sight with Cell"
Jove/Noel have this consistent bunny thing where people lose vision magically lol. From the writing, at the time, there's no rule if you get damaged by environment. If there's no rule then, there should be no damage. It makes sense yes, there should be fall damage on site, but there isn't so superhuman character outweighs.
"After hour or so of deliberation this is it."
That's very short time for battle modding, when in Roman's case he then one-shot Cell a topic later.
"Since it’s Cell post I cannot claim a hit for something that has not been reacted to yet."
What Roman seemingly did, something wrong to do as battle modder, is tell Cell what he could call a hit for. This means the battle mod gave pre-approval, without the input of the person that would be hit. When a battle modder (like Jove in previous tournament posts) gives more input than necessary, it's unnecessarily favoring another side. You're only supposed to comment on what you're called for. Considering Roman/Geno and Jove are best friends/Geno is his teacher/admin in fap chat, I don't see this as remotely fair.
- TIMELESS art:
- https://www.fairytailrp.com/t41749-final-round-finn-vs-maarschalk
Noel linked me this fight himself recently (generally unprompted flexing), yet his version was a Wayback Machine since he's scared it gets deleted I guess.
"Lifting his foot on the blocking leg up to flex the muscle in front of his shin so as to counter the leg kick with his own shin, the goal was that Maarschalk's leg would break on impact. Finn would make sure his leg was at a ninety degree angle, and his check would add momentum right back at his opponents own- This would damage Maarschalk more than it would actually damage Finn. The timing of this block was as Maarschalk's began the actual leg kick, meaning the giants right leg and waist were already likely turning into the kick- Much too late to cancel that momentum that brought him forward at a fast and effective pace."
"His left arm would extend sideways over the front of his body, ready to go down or up dependent on either of Maarschalk's fists or his legs in order to deflect or block any blows. His hand would also be sideways with his hand open, palm facing the arena at a slight upper angle to deflect the leg if it came up at him or redirected, as well as to be able to easier redirect any punches by the giant."
"Either his leg would break, causing him to drop to the ground due to the break, or his leg would simply suffer some damage from this contact and Maarschalk would have to place it down."
"But not my legs. I’d like to point out how this made it impossible to see what my leg was targeting."
Noel insinuates, you put your arms/hands in the general vicinity of your face in a prior line of your post and you're blinded. After that, he generally gaslights "well, your leg is a few inches to the side, it won't reach in time." This was a hand to hand only tourney I believe, so Noel made the most extreme stretch to say his opponent couldn't react at all and they were one-shot on contact.
Staff overthinks topic: "I gotta make a ruling on these 2 high-profile guys". It's fact Roman/Geno was close to Noel and Jove, I don't see why they're final round in a tourney.
So Noel, for this topic you're so proud of you show people years later/Jove stands by you for, I wonder what Geno/Roman has to say about it. Hey, idk, they might actually still support this ruling for you. If I was them tho? "lol, what can I say? years ago, was I just going to say nothing? just worked with whatever."
Recent fights maybe later, like how Esperia hand to handed Shichiro to L
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